Christian Video Game idea

[Seraph_Lytshade]

I'm working/writing for a movie series idea that will eventually be developed into a video game.

It's called Before the Fall. It's about how Satan turned away from God, got 1/3 of the entire angelic population to turn away, and the war that ensues. The series ends with a scene of Adam and Eve walking up to the tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil - fade out, credits roll.

After that first series is done, I'm wanting to do a second series, and this one will probably be a mini-series that you'll see on the silver screen. It's about spiritual warfare, and the battles that angels and demons have over us. For the video game of this series, you will NEVER play a demon/fallen angel (bcz there are already too many games out now where ALL you play is a "complex" person). Any angel you play as, you are assigned a human to protect and guide. You fight for windows to be opened that they might receive/perceive God's truth. The demons try and thwart this.

In order for you to proceed further in the game, there are barriers you must cross by solving puzzles or riddles. And to solve these puzzles and riddles, you MUST use either one of two things. A Bible, or a Strong's Concordance.

Each angel and demon, as a part of their character, are given control over certain elements. (i.e. fire, wind, water, light, shadow, dream/spirit, so on and so forth)

...sound fun?

my gameplay style will be very much like Kingdom Hearts/DMC/God of War-ish. Full 3D rendering, battle combo system, EXP rank/level ups...the whole nine yards. The puzzles and barrier points will be handled similarly to Final Fantasy games. (FFX comes to mind)

Much like Kingdom Hearts and other FF games, the final boss in my game will be pretty difficult, yes...but the sidequests offer much more challenging conflicts. For example, you end up fighting Satan's shadow at one point. It can teleport almost anywhere, and the best way to hit it is to counter/parry an attack, leaving it's guard open...and this is no easy task. Kind of like Sephiroth floating up to cast Sin Harvest/Heartless Angel. If you don't catch him before he casts it....you're nearly screwed. Same concept.

RPG Maker allows me to at least put something down on paper. I already have two or three other artists willing to put in ideas and concepts for demons and other angels. My demons/fallen angels will most likely be gods and Titans in Greek mythology. Story goes, they accept Satan's proposal to turn away from God because he promises them a state of "godhood" themselves later. Well, he delivered (more or less). Poseidon controls water, Haephestus controls fire, Apollo controls light, and Venus....is a whore. A gorgeous one...but a whore nonetheless. When you defeat her, she withers away into this ugly old looking wench (her true identity).

With Venus, I JUST thought this as I was writing this post. So as you can see, I'm still improvising on ideas. The Lord is still speaking to me, and I can't wait to go to Liberty University to expand my crew and ideas.

Does anyone approve/disapprove?

[Seraph_Lytshade]

anyone? comments? questions? approvals/disapprovals?

[goldenspines]

Please don't be discouraged because you don't get very many responses here, Seraph. This part of the forum is not very active usually. ^_^;

Your desire to make a Christian game is a good goal to shoot for, but this whole idea of a crossover of angels/demons and fantasy sounds a little weird. But that may just be me.
The idea, as you say, is still is a bit unrefined and leaves a lot of room for improvement. I wish you luck in working on perfecting it.

[Esoteric]

Hey there, welcome to CAA!

I wish you luck with your endeavors. Truth is, you may not seem to find much interest around here for your idea, but that's not because it doesn't have potential. Seems like every week someone makes a post about their grand aspirations for making a game, anime series, manga or whatever, and most of these efforts have a life span measured inside a couple months before they are abandoned. Because of this, talk gets cheap after a while and people largely ignore such posts, so don't take it the wrong way. You'll generate more interest from people when you actually have something to show in the way of real progress.

As for the idea itself, Christian games have sadly garnered a reputation for being un-fun because they're usually more focused on gospel than gameplay (which sacrifices the quality and enjoyment of the latter.) That said, your idea is interesting, and the elemental aspects of the angels and demons could work very well since it's a tried and true gameplay element. I really have nothing further to add at this point except to say you've got your work cut out for you and again I wish you luck and success with it.

[Seraph_Lytshade]

Yes, I'm well aware that I have my work cut out for me. I have tons of script and source material written out. Thanks for the feedback, both of you. But I assure you, my idea will not die off. I've had it ever since my sophomore year of highschool (I'm 24 now).

Well, I have plenty of character analysis and concepts written/drawn. And by plenty I mean at least 10 of the main ones. In terms of crossing the bridge between angels/demons and fantasy, I believe that bridge could have been crossed historically speaking. It's plausible, but I'm also not saying it's factual.

In between Genesis 1:1 and 1:2 (v1. In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. v2. The earth was formless and void, without form) I believe there is a huge unknown period of time. The NASB version (truer to Hebrew translation) says the earth "became" formless and void. WHY was the earth formless and void? That's prob because Satan and his cronies rebelled and warred against the Elect angels, phasing everything out. So what you see in Genesis is God restoring the universe PLUS creating humans. I believe that this is another reason we are called God's beloved. We were meant to succeed where Satan failed, and that's why Satan came down to tempt us away. It sux that he did.

Also, in the Old Testament, (can't remember the reference, gosh darnit) I believe it talks about fallen sons interbreeding with humans. This is where the Nephilim came from. This was also the reason for the world being as wicked as it was before the flood, hence the need for the flood. The Lost City of Atlantis might actually have existed. And think about this: What if an actual fallen angel appeared before some Greek scholar who knew little to nothing about Scripture and divine creatures? Sounds like they'd revere them as gods...gods like Zeus, Apollo, Venus, etc. The rest is history.

Now the angels are given charge over the ones who choose to follow the Lord.
What say you?

[Silent Seraph]

I have a few questions though....ONE-What kind of game would it be, and TWO- If you program it ,can i test it?

O and i've always thought the demons used sinful men to interbreed creating even worse children (Nephilim). But your idea would work very nicely for a game.

[Seraph_Lytshade]

the type/genre of the game will have the adventure aspect of Final Fantasy and Kingdom Hearts, but will look like Devil May Cry or God of War, graphically speaking. Yes, there will be blood, but not like God of War or DMC 3. I want it to be like the movie Last Samauri or Braveheart. Nothing over the top but not held back, either. I'm not AIMING for an "M" rating, but that's probably what it'll get.

Like Zelda games and FF games, it'll have puzzles and sidequests you can engage to get special celestial items, but in order to get anywhere, you'll need either a Bible or a Strong's Concordance to find keywords or missing phrases.

Combo-fighting system will be almost identical to the feel of Devil May Cry 3 and 4. Different angels have different weapons [i.e. sword(s), staffs, makeshift bows that split into short swords, sickles, scythes, whips (for the angel of death), and one angel gets guns], so combo systems are learned. Juggling enemies will never be so much fun.

I know this sounds like "all-ambition and no initiative," but trust me, I have connections through Liberty University and other students that study there. My friend Mike is already an excellent graphics artist and script writer for programs. Plus, I have connections with professional companies that have Christian friends of mine as employees.

I'm posting all this here to see if anyone is at least interested or is willing to submit ideas.

[Silent Seraph]

Sounds good just a couple more questions for you....

What would be the setting? Considering Earth wouldn't be created yet and contant heaven/hell environment would get tiresome.

Would you create your own angel/demon char. or have preset chars. (i.e.- Michael, Lucifer, Angel of Death)

[Seraph_Lytshade]

The setting would be modern day. Since only a limited few of angels and demons were mentioned by name in the Bible, I'll be using them, but a ton of other characters I'll have created myself (with my team, of course).

Heaven will most likely be accessible either thru portal-points or moments where not much is going on. Still haven't decided yet. You'll only see the kingdom of Satan and his followers in cutscenes or playbacks (it's not hell. that's the place of torment).

Angels fight and contend for the souls of man to be enlightened with the Truth that only the Holy Spirit can give. Demons try and distort/corrupt things around your charge (the human you're assigned to). You must do things to prevent this. You have to encourage your charge to pray or read their Bible, otherwise you may not have the strength or power bonuses you'll need to defeat other demons. They CAN overpower you if you're careless. For each human that there will be in the game (number unknown at the moment), there's a storyline for that character. Your playable angel's mission is given at different points throughout the story.

Does that help?

[Silent Seraph]

Yes it does thank you.

So no character customizing? Thats fine although if its a multilplayer/co-op game i'd be more willing to play it

[mechana2015]

How can a modern day setting be "Before the Fall" ?

Just having trouble making the connection.

[ich1990]

One of the greatest difficulties, I think, that a game of this type faces is knowing where it is appropriate and effective to take creative license. The Bible doesn't say much about Lucifer's rebellion so there is room to work with, but it isn't always easy balancing that with, say an omni-potent and omni-benevolent God. It easy to run into deep theology really fast with this type of setup, and even Milton had trouble reconciling everything.

If I might suggest something, then, please read some of the great stories that have tackled this sort of thing before. Paradise Lost by John Milton is highly recommended in this regard. Dante Alighieri also has an incredibly imaginative view of Heaven and Hell in his Divine Comedy. I think you will find that even if they don't inspire you, they will at least tell you where fiction of this sort has traveled before. Forewarned is forearmed. You have centuries worth of literary criticism of those two epics to learn from; maybe you could avoid their pitfalls or improve on their formulas?

I know that laying all sorts of homework on a burgeoning project seems like a cruel way to put a damper on the flames of inspiration, but research is an integral part of the creative process. As much as I hate to be negative towards something with such good intentions, to make a Christian Video Game of mainstream quality, well, you are going to need all of the help you can get. You might as well learn from those who have been there before you, plot-wise.

[Seraph_Lytshade]

How can a modern day setting be "Before the Fall" ?

Just having trouble making the connection.

Obstute observation. I failed to mention that the timeframes of the movies will obviously have to be changed. "Before the Fall" is the initial trilogy that will take place before the creation of man. It's the kick off of the franchise.

This second series I'll be making the game out of will be called The Host's Charges. A "host" is described as appearring to the shepherd at the time of Christ's birth. A host is an army..armed to the teeth, ready for battle. A "charge" is like a mark, or a subject. An angel's charge, is his/her assigned human to guide and protect.

Yes it does thank you.

So no character customizing? Thats fine although if its a multilplayer/co-op game i'd be more willing to play it

Well, if there WOULD be characterization, it'd be similar to that of SoulCalibur III and IV's...but the angels you will play as will be directly from the movies. Ethan is an omni-elemental, but he's a lower rank angel. He uses a staff which he can infuse any elemental attack he wishes, but not too many at once of course. Deana is the only (girl) angel who uses gun-based weaponry. She even wields a "gunblade"-esque type of weapon. Azrael is the angel of death, and he's a good angel, dressed in whites and blues, and uses a scythe. (Taking the grim reaper concept and turning it completely upside down. Being a writer is so much fun! )

I'm still questioning whether to let Michael be a playable character. If he is, it'll be a side bonus mission. His element is wind, and his sword is so long, his hilt materializes first, and then the blade comes out of an eagle's beak at the end of the hilt. Satan's sword operates the same way, except it's a dragon on the hilt (in the books).

But yeah, there are always too many things that can be done with a video game nowadays. Character custimazation may be out. In the multiplayer mode, it's more like a sparring deal. You can either see how many demons you can banish/slay, or you can make "training" runs on each other using moves you've learned. It'll be much fun.

[Peanut]

You seem rather passionate about this idea, so I'm going to be as honest as I can about this idea to help you. Some of what I'm going to say is going to be rather blunt and may hurt. I'm not trying to shoot down your idea, I am however concerned about a number of things.

-I'm a Theology Major. So, my life during school is research papers, pouring over sources like commentaries and thinking about rather weighty things. I do enjoy doing research papers so if anyone would be interested in searching through the Bible or a Strong's Concordance for answers, I'm would be the guy. However, I'm not and can't think of anyone who would want to sit down and play a video game that requires you to use a Strong's Concordance.

-When it comes to using the Bible as a source for solutions to puzzles, I have two major concerns. One, this has been done before and it hasn't been very successful. There are a ton of Christian Games which have tried this and have turned some gamers off to any game labeled Christian. Second, I think depending on the puzzles, you could essentially be teaching your audience to read verses out of context. This is already a big problem in Christianity so believe me when I say it doesn't need to be encouraged.

-Angels have no gender.

-How much freedom do you plan on giving Satan in all of this? Because, Biblically, God is sovereign over Satan. I mean, look at the book of Job. Satan doesn't go off and torment Job because of his own free will. He doesn't even ask God. God has to mention it to him and then give him permission after he essentially says "If you didn't treat him so well he'd reject you?" That's hardly the Satan which is often portrayed in our culture as constantly scheming and resisting against God in some epic struggle between good and evil. Heck, even in Revelation when he gathers all the nations together there isn't even a battle. He gets annihilated without even fighting back because, after all, how can you fight against God?

-Why are you using names from the Greek Pantheon for demons instead of the lists which have been traditionally used in the Church for years or even the Sumerian Pantheon?

-What happens if you get a Game Over? Will this at all imply that God has lost or are you going to go the Act Raiser route and have it so God doesn't actually loose but is just suffering a temporary set back?

[Cognitive Gear]

I'm curious as to what your purpose is with this story:

-Is it intended as fantasy entertainment for Christians?

-Is it some kind of evangelism tool?

-While being theologically accurate is probably impossible, given the great number of views out there, how tightly do you intend to adhere to scripture?

[Fish and Chips]

Frankly Seraph, and despite my usual tone with these sort of posts I'm trying to be as polite as possible, I think you have your head stuck in the clouds. Your pre-supposed success for this gaming project of yours apparently plays off a to-exist pre-existing media franchise spanning several films, a mini-series on "the silver screen," adapted novels, and popularly iconic T-shirts no doubt, let alone the game you're intent on making. That isn't how the creative process works. You do one short-term project, and if it's reasonably well recieved you might have a shot at making a sequel, maybe, if the almighty marketing executives or financial backers you have are feeling particularly merciful or optimistic. And you're going to need those marketing executives and financial backers plenty if your fixated on God of War level production values. Game development is an expensive field, where even a cheap puzzle game like Tetris, Tetris of all things, can cost thousands of dollars just to design, much less mass produce, advertise, and distribute.

I appologize if this comes off harshly, but I feel it's an important point. Furthermore, most people prefer their games to be packaged self-contained, so unless you can cut a deal on including the alledged manditory Bibles and Concordances along with the shipping, you're going to run into problems.

Secondly, echoing slightly some of Peanut's sentiments, using the Bible in the fashion you've suggested sounds like trivializing it. The Bible is an important document to Christianity, but this reduces it to a hardbound coffee table strategy guide, cracking it open to the right verse just so you can reach the end boss on the other side of this puzzle. Not the most intuitive of settings.

And thirdly, undertaking any project like this, especially as a Christian yourself, you'd better be prepared to do your homework. Players may have to leaf through Strong's Conchordance for protips, but you'll have had to have memorized a good portion of it with how much you'll have double checked it to keep theologically savvy. You'll probably have to borrow Ich1990's copies of the Divine Comedy and Paradise Lost too, though they technically border on glorified fanfiction, just to get a feel for how the genre has already set itself up.

Again, I know this will probably read in a dark mood, for which I, again, appologize, but I feel it has to be said.

[Ingemar]

^ Well, if he's going to make it a huge theological undertaking, may as well include the Patristic writings of Athanasius of Alexandria, Ambrose of Milan, Augustine of Hippo, Gregory of Nyssa, Basil the Great, John of Damascus (and more--I'm sure I didn't even scratch the surface).

The process of divinization is not unknown to Christian tradition. Look up theosis on Wikipedia to see what I mean.

[Peanut]

^ Well, if he's going to make it a huge theological undertaking, may as well include the Patristic writings of Athanasius of Alexandria, Ambrose of Milan, Augustine of Hippo, Gregory of Nyssa, Basil the Great, John of Damascus (and more--I'm sure I didn't even scratch the surface).

The process of divinization is not unknown to Christian tradition. Look up theosis on Wikipedia to see what I mean.

I think this may be actually going a little bit to far for what he is trying to do. Not to say that there aren't things that he could definitely draw from, however he it seems pretty clear to me that he isn't trying to make a game that is a magnum opus of Theology (nor would I suggest that he tries to do that). He isn't going to necessarily need an intimate knowledge of a broad spectrum of Theological positions on subjects that won't really relate to what he's trying to accomplish. Personally, I think the research he needs to do has to be a lot more specific and focus on the topics he's covering and using with this idea (like reading theological works on angels and demons or something like the Inferno/Divine Comedy) instead of looking at writers who are known for developing the doctrine of the Trinity or Mary being taken up into heaven after she died.

[Seraph_Lytshade]

(sorry for the double post here, but the next post down is my finished product. lol)

[Seraph_Lytshade]

wow. okay, several things.

In concerns to having my "head in the clouds":
...so what? My dreams are still reachable. People who attain their dreams initially had those dreams in those same clouds that mine are in. Kids dream of flying fighter jets, and by age 25, they've attained those goals. I am not insulted by your observation. You are correct in stating that my ambitious nature is on an extreme high. But I DO have the motivation to get it done. I don't just sit around and think up of new stuff. I write, I draw, and I'm trying my absolute best to make it a reality.

Considering your concerns about trivializing the Bible and a Strong's Concordance..you're possibly right. The thought had occured to me, I will be honest. I am now currently torn on this issue. I will admit that. My original intent, of course, is to offer more opportunities for people to actually pick up their Bible..period. So many Christians (including myself) don't do this enough. Maybe God can use this opportunity to get someone to read something in a different light, or read something they never knew was there and just continue reading for the sake of continuing reading it, because they're curious.

But yes, there is the flip side of the coin. The side that makes the Bible a simple crutch to help them get from one point to another in something that doesn't even matter in light of eternity, a video game. Big woop. I love games, but they're not everything, nor should they be. But..then again, if I'm only trying to encourage anyone, Christians and non-Christians alike, to pick up their Bibles, it's ultimately up to them how to want to go about doing things from that point on.

In terms of incorporating other theological sources, I will have to concur with Peanut's last statement. There really is no use going into Catholic lore and doctrines. I'll put it straight out on the line. What I'm going for is very similar to that of Frank Peretti's books "This Present Darkness" and "Piercing the Darkness." THAT kind of warfare and character development. I seriously don't think there is anything wrong with my theology. I tell others what I believe and why I believe it, and even though they never thought of it, they agree that it is most certainly plausible. I've read bits and pieces of Dante's Inferno, and Paradise Lost. In terms of imagery, I've got that in the bag.

But seriously, to all who have replied, I thank you and welcome more input. I have no problem or qualm with receiving criticism, be it bad or even ugly.

Using a video game as an evangelistic tool is way too hard for even me to wrap my head around. It will not be a main aim for the game, or on my "agenda," as it were. It's simply to portray an epic story on a supernatural level that actually happened. Perhaps this might spark an interest in someone to find out what the angels are really all about and what their purpose is..which is to ultimately serve God by serving us. The angels subjugate themselves under us (but not necessarily TO us), and that's an important factor. I want my audience to realize that God does so much for us and how much he values us. The stereotypical paradigm people hold (even other Christians sometimes) is that angels hold a higher sense of authority in the grand scheme of things, when that's simply not true.

One passion that I have in this world, concerning the Christian faith, is to try my absolute best to break those cliche/stereotypical boundaries that hinder certain key elements of thought and perception, particularly perceptions of the spiritual nature. Realizing how much God cherishes and values us never gets old. He holds us in higher esteem than his angels. His angels know this, and the Heavenly Host is more than fine with this. They see it as an opportunity to serve God in yet another fashion. They remain humble under His rule and order, and we're the ones reaping the benefits. How awesome is THAT?!

Anyways, I hope that helps.

[Midknight74012]

I'm not as wordy as the other people that posted. But I believe your idea has quite a bit of potential, it would be awesome if this was made for real.